Terminology

[floit63]

This post got me thinking. How many of our arguments (either amongst ourselves or with others) stem from the fact that everyone has a slightly different interpretation of key words we use? I'm going to post a few different words that are rather important when discussing trans issues and I'd love it if everyone could go through and give their definitions of these words so that I can make a list for n00bs (all of them can be anon if you wish). My own definitions will be in the comments.

The Words:
Sex
Gender
Transgender
Transexual
Trans*
Male
Female
Man/boy
Woman/girl
Cisgender
Gay
Lesbian
Straight
Bisexual
Pansexual
Polysexual
Asexual
Ally
Stealth
Out (as in out of the closet, not as in out to the store)
Pride

Comments

[downtide]

well mine turned out to be more concise than I expected so here goes:


Sex - the act of.... no wait. This would be a person's physical, bodily sex. The current one, not necessarily the one at birth.
Gender - This would be where a person self-identifies on the masculine-feminine spectrum.
Transgender - a person whose gender does not match their current physical sex
Transexual - a person whose gender dos not match birth sex, and has undergone or is undergoing transition in order to change sex.
Trans* - umbrella covering transgender and transsexual
Male - an adjective to describe a person at the masculine end of the gender spectrum
Female - an adjective to describe a person at the feminine end of the gender spectrum
Man/boy - a noun to describe a person of masculine gender
Woman/girl - a noun to describe a person of feminine gender
Cisgender - a person whose gender and sex were always in agreement and has not undergone transition
Gay - sexual attraction to people of the same gender as oneself
Lesbian - as above but limited to female-gendered people
Straight - sexual attraction to people of the opposite gender to oneself
Bisexual - sexual attraction to people at either end of the gender spectrum, both male and female
Pansexual - sexual attraction to people anywhere on the gender spectrum
Polysexual - I actually have never heard this term before and can't imagine how it would differ from Pansexual
Asexual - lack of sexual attraction
Ally - someone who is not transgendered but is a supporter of those who are.
Stealth - living totally in the closet as one's chosen (new) gender without revealing one's past.
Out (as in out of the closet, not as in out to the store) - being open to others (in terms of trans*-ness or sexual orientation)
Pride - sense of belonging to or identifying with the LGBT community

[downtide]

I forgot to include "Pride" as the annual GLBT parade event too, thanks for reminding me floit63

[floit63]

I always love reading the differences in definitions people use. Transgender and transexual in particular, those have changed quite a bit even just in the time I've been part of the community.

[maudlinstreet]

Man/boy - a noun to describe a person of masculine gender
Woman/girl - a noun to describe a person of feminine gender
Male - an adjective to describe a person at the masculine end of the gender spectrum
Female - an adjective to describe a person at the feminine end of the gender spectrum

Uhhhhhhhhh NO NO NO NO.

Gender - This would be where a person self-identifies on the masculine-feminine spectrum.

People who are not really self-aware about gender also HAVE a gender.

Transgender - a person whose gender does not match their current physical sex
Transexual - a person whose gender dos not match birth sex, and has undergone or is undergoing transition in order to change sex.

WHAT?

[floit63]

If you're going to insist that there's something wrong with his definitions please have a reason to back up your opinions rather than just using exclamatories.

[auntysarah]

please have a reason to back up your opinions

Was People who are not really self-aware about gender also HAVE a gender. unclear? It seemed both concise and precise to me.

[floit63]

One out of three ain't bad?

[maudlinstreet]

Defining maleness and manhood with masculinity and femaleness and womanhood with femininity reinforces compulsory gender expression (I mean seriously, to 1950s standards) and conflates sex, gender identity with gender expression, variables that are important to keep distinct from one another (especially the last two). I know men who I would consider more feminine than I will ever be and women who are more masculine than most men I know.

Gender is taken for granted by many cis people and it can be a rare moment when someone actually bothers to say "Am I masculine or feminine for my sex/gender?" Additionally, there are gender identifications that lie outside of a masculine or feminine spectrum.

There are quite a number of transgender-identified persons who are quite content with their genitalia (I guess that is what is meant by the imprecise term, "physical sex"). Many people who are satisfied with the extent to which they have altered their primary and secondary sex characteristics (I guess that is what is meant by "change sex") continue to identify as transgender. That definition makes it sound as though a transgender person is an "incomplete" transsexual person.

[ten]

Unless I completely misunderstood floit63, the point of this post is to see what differences people have in their personal definitions, and what they have in common, ideally so that a common middle ground can be achieved for a least some things.

If your personal definitions differ from the ones expressed so far, by all means, share them with us.

Simply rage-capslocking at other definitions however is not only rude, it is also not productive to the discussion.

[floit63]

Thank you.

[snakey]

so that a common middle ground can be achieved for a least some things

...so, wait. If I think someone's definition is transphobic, I should try and reach a 'middle ground'?

[floit63]

No, but it would be helpful to post your own definitions so that we can see some alternatives. Simply arguing without giving another option doesn't generally help anyone.

[ten]

Nothing in my comment said that. Or are you the discussion?

If you disagree, however strongly, with someone's definition, please go on and elaborate so that the discussion can actually be fruitful, and not just people being angry at each other.

[downtide]

thanks :)

[downtide]

I'd love to see how your definitions differ. Please post them?

[downtide]

People who are not really self-aware about gender also HAVE a gender.

This would be... who, exactly? Babies under a year old? The mentally disabled and unable to communicate? Of course they have a gender, we just don't know what it is.

[floit63]

I'm fairly certain maudlinstreet meant that even if people don't really think about their gender they still have one. Most cispeople, for example, never question their gender. They simply assume that penis = man and vagina = woman.

[downtide]

well yes they do have a gender but it's not for me or maudlinstreet or anyone else to define that gender by looking at their physical appearance. Just because a person has a vagina doesn't make them a woman, necessarily.

[floit63]

I seem to be confused. Your definition of gender is something that is self-chosen, correct? maudlinstreet's argument appears to be that some people never make a conscious decision about their gender because they assume it's synonymous to their sex. However, they still have a gender (if pressed they tend to go with man/boy or woman/girl), they simply haven't made a choice about what it is.

Where does defining someone else's gender for them come into this?

Deleted the other comment because I was logged into the wrong account, sorry about that.

[downtide]

I seem to be confused.

So do I.

I thought I had everything clear in my head but now I'm not even sure I belong here if my definitions are so far off base from what everyone else is using.

[floit63]

Oh don't be scared off just yet. I was merely trying to clarify so that the discussion didn't turn into a giant flame war. This post is more to get a general idea of how everyone defines things so that we can avoid arguments in the future. So far you're not all that different from everyone else anyway.